You are not my master. Quoting Christ to me doesn't make you Christ. I can't believe I have to say this.
These are natural goals, naturalistic. There's nothing supernatural about them. You're preaching practical atheism. Anyone who can practice love, mercy and compassion in your view is your brother, whatever they happen to believe. There are Hindu yogis out there, who are so concerned with mercy towards living creatures, that they will walk barefoot so as to make sure not to squash the life of even the littlest ant on the ground. I don't know of any Christian who does that. Maybe they should, by your standard? Maybe we should all become more Hindu. You're a practical atheist, Legion. Just admit that. It's an embarrassment to all of your ancestors in England who were saints and martyrs. May Christ have mercy on your soul, on the day of judgment.
As far as I know none of my ancestors were either saints or martyrs, but if it makes you happy to believe that the opposite of someone who wants to terrorise people into belief with talk of hellfire is a 'practical atheist' then you go right ahead. It makes no difference whatever to me. Or my eternal salvation. Fwiw I found a slug in the middle of the path this morning when I was walking and I picked it up and put it into the grass because the sun was already hot and it would not otherwise have survived. I regard this as a perfectly Christian thing to do. Why not? It cost me nothing at all and it reminded me that life is fragile.
Lord only knows. And this: I am not sure why some believers use verses of Scripture as weapons against other believers, and I am not at all convinced that this is what we should be using them for.
Again, I have no idea what you’re talking about (and I’ve read the entire thread). I assumed you would know what you meant since my question only quoted your words. Nobody on this thread was personally attacking you.
Newman has some similar things to say about this in one of the chapters in the Grammar of Assent. You might appreciate some of his remarks pertaining to conscience. https://newmanreader.org/works/grammar/chapter5-1.html#section1
I think you need to go back and read what I have written before you run on about me claiming to be your master, don't you? Consider the fact you might just be wrong. Quoting Christ doesn't make anyone Christ, least of all me. It just makes them knowledgeable about what Christ said, about people who think they can "Say anything they like", free from any future reprimands from their Master Matt.12:37. I was assuming Jesus Christ is your master as he is also mine. We can't just say whatever we like without possible future consequences. James 3:2-6. I'm not criticising you, I'm laying down a principle of discipleship we should all be aware of. What we have here is a simple misunderstanding of what was actually written. Do that with scripture and you wind up with a heresy. . .
Since Jesus Christ is our Lord (Master, ruler), His words carry the weight of ultimate authority. His words should show you the mind of and will of Christ and should guide you in your own thoughts and beliefs. I hope you will not be dismissive of the word of Jesus when we quote Him. He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day. (John 12:48) ...the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life. (John 6:63)
So you think it is your job to reprove and correct other Christians? On the internet? In public? And you use verses of Scripture against them? I'm not sure that approach is at all Scriptural, but you carry on if it makes you happy.
I will be dismissive of anyone who uses the words of Christ against me as a weapon. The ONLY person qualified to do so is my own priest, because he knows who I am, and what my life is. Scripture is not a weapon to use against brothers and sisters in faith. Quoting Christ doesn't make anyone Christ, nor grant them his authority, unless they are speaking with Christ's love as well. Without love the words become as a clashing gong. I can't believe I am having to say this.
21 out of the 27 books of the New Testament are letters from various Christians reproving and correcting other Christians, usually with other verses of Scripture. Would you care to explain why you believe that approach is not Scriptural? A lot of members of this forum make themselves very vulnerable by quoting the bible and explaining in detail what conclusions they have reached. It's a bit discomforting to see you so regularly dismiss others reasoned opinions with a few flippant words and no evidence. Naturally one of the objects of this forum is to learn. If I ever misinterpret scripture it is good if you then come along and instruct me on why I'm wrong, but that won't ever happen if you simply assert others are wrong and don't use evidence to prove your position. "Good grief" and "I can't believe I have to say this" only serve to belittle the person you're responding to, not help them learn anything or change their opinions.
May I point out that you seem OK with reproving others on the internet, in public, with no scriptural backing whatever, only by force of your own opinion though and seem quite 'happy' about it. Just saying. I don't want to cross swords with you. I perceive we are probably singing from similar theological hymnsheets. .
Happy? Totally, thanks. However, I am not claiming to speak for God or throwing random Scripture verses at other people like grenades. I am just me expressing mostly astonishment at what I have found here. Lots of defending, precious little of anything else. My hymnsheet is simple. Without the love of God in Christ nothing else we do has any meaning whatever. If you want me to find a verse to substantiate this, just let me know; I won't have any problems. ‘Now,’ said Mr Tigg, clapping one hand on the shoulder of his prepossessing friend, and calling Mr Pecksniff’s attention to him with the other, ‘you two are related; and relations never did agree, and never will; which is a wise dispensation and an inevitable thing, or there would be none but family parties, and everybody in the world would bore everybody else to death. If you were on good terms, I should consider you a most confoundedly unnatural pair; but standing towards each other as you do, I took upon you as a couple of devilish deep-thoughted fellows, who may be reasoned with to any extent.’ From Martin Chuzzlewit, by Dickens
Here it is again; quoting the blessed Paul does NOT equate to having the authority of the blessed Paul. Fortunately for those he was writing to he spent a great deal of his time encouraging and praising, and rightly so.
Who said anything about having the authority of Paul? What on Earth are you talking about? We're talking about if correcting fellow Christians is consistent with scripture.
Perhaps then an apology for falsely accusing me of 'Mastering it' over you would be well received by me, and would demonstrate to the rest of us, your own good intent to limit the grenade throwing from your corner of the debate, when you may have mistakenly miscontrued another members comment as being an attack upon yourself? I doubt it is possible to attain maturity of spirit in Christ, in the age in which we live, without having soaked up a good deal of scripture and understood it, though I do agree with what you say concerning the love of God in Christ. To have only a scant understanding of scripture renders one indeed 'simple'. Though simplicity by no means hinders salvation. .
Quite so ZachT. I accepted your correction of my mistake gracefully. Those whose criticism alerts us to chicks in our salvation armour are always doing us a service, especially if they can back up their observation with scripture. .
I see it as a bit of both really, but that may seem like a cop out. I base all my theology on what Jesus Christ said, did and believed. He said the Kingdom of God is already come upon us, all we need to do is enter it and live by its rules. We are by nature, it seems, reluctant to do so though. Entering the Kingdom of God is a very simple affair though. All that is required is for us to hold onto nothing which would keep us out of it. It has been provided for us by God who has feeely given it to us. So in view of all this our natural inclination NOT to accept God's free gift of entrance into The Kingdom of God is all that is keeping us OUT of it. So we surely must be saved as a norm but those who fail to enter, fail because they won't let go of those things we all hold so dear to us. Matt.10:39, Matt.16:25. It is Our Father's good pleasure to GIVE US the Kingdom, but in our foolishness we so often reject it and go our own way, preferring the works of darkness. Luke 12:32. That's all that is keeping it only a little flock. God doesn't want to condemn the whole human race. He died on a cross to save it all, but they either don't appreciate it or don't know about it yet. Now tell me that is no incentive to go out and preach The Kingdom Gospel. Everyone should know it, but they don't, mostly because the church often doesn't preach it. .