Vatican Announces Commission on Women Deacons [AmericaMagazine]

I agree that the way things work today, deacons generally move on to becoming Priests. Deacons should be men. If there is a return to female deaconesses in either the RC or EO, this order should be different from the order of Deacons and should not lead to the Priesthood. I think that that would be what was intended by EO advocates of a female diaconate. I imagine that this would also be what the Pope would want, if indeed the Pope rally wants a female diaconate. As for individuals in the RC - I don't know what their expectations of a female diaconate would be. A female diaconate in itself is fine. It would be up to the Church to keep that order within its own boundaries.

 

Have a look at the short answer to the question "What is the position on Orthodoxy on the ordination of women" that comes at the end of the article on Ministry as it expresses an Eastern Orthodox view on female deacons and the diaconate in general - regarding the diaconate (male or female) as a different order to that of the ministry. In this view it is the West that have come to regard Deacons as apprentice Priests or Priests in waiting, which is not what the order used to be.
http://www.orthodoxresource.co.uk/orthodoxy/ministry.htm

 

Although we knew this was coming due to the Pope's statement earlier in the year, this is nonetheless concerning and troubling. Holy Orders are reserved to men by God's sacred design.

 

A deaconess is different from a female deacon

 

Priest and Bishops - yes, reserved to men
Deacons - in the early Church meaning of Deacons - no, there were men and women in the diaconate
Deacons - in the way they are considered in some modern Western Churches - probably should be men only as the role appears to lead eventually to the Priesthood. However, this is not the original meaning or purpose of the diaconate.
Depends what the RC Church means by this move.

 

Absolutely - certainly in today's understanding. In the early Church they may have had a similar role, as a male Deacon was not a Priest in waiting (at least that is what I have gathered for my research so far) in the same way that they seem to be today in Churches that have Deacons.

 

Scripture is absolutely clear on who can be a deacon, priest and bishop. Only certain males who fit the criteria. Any Church that ordains a female to the orders of deacon, priest or bishop is going against the written and establish will of God.

That said. Were there deaconesses. Yes. They mainly helped with women and children's issues. As in Baptism. The early Church baptized converts in the nude. As it was unseemly for males to look upon nude females, still is regardless what the world says, women deaconesses helped in baptism.

In my jurisdiction, the Reformed Episcopal Church, we have the order of Deaconess. My Diocese has two. They assist the Bishop as he sees fit. Our Bishop in Dallas has a Deaconess running the Bishops office. In my diocese they are running ministries for women and children in urban areas. They are assigned to a parish and assist in that parish as the priest desires. They do not have a sacramental role. They may read lessons, they do not assist at the altar or process in. Unless they are in the choir.

Deaconesses and Virgins morphed into Nuns and Sisters religious. I believe if Anglicanism would focus on those religious orders it would be benefit the church.

Wonder why women are not clamoring for the order of Virgin? Virgins served the early church just as much as the deaconess. Could it be more about power than service?

Blessings,

Fr. Mark

 

Sorry to derail for a sec, but I would truly love to become a deaconess. I was counseled not to become an Anglican nun, at age 15 by my church's Deacon, as he said that the harder path is to live a sacrificial life as a layperson. I still feel called to service, and the path of a deaconess seems fitting.

 

I wasn't aware that there were Anglican nuns. Is this commonplace?

 

http://www.anglican.ca/faith/

There are Anglican nuns - I'm not sure if that's common, but there are nuns.
Sorry that the link does not go directly to.the listings - I am using my phone to post this and will post the correct link tomorrow.

 

I wouldn't call it a fantasy, rather than re-calling how things used to work. It was explained to me that having the office of deacon as a stepping stone to the priesthood is something Anglicans inherited from Rome, but is (was) not the case in the East. There seems to be a shortage of deacons now (at least here in South Africa) because they all seem to move up the ecclesial ladder.

Now that I think about it, I am not clear why the RCC is looking at this because they do have Nuns who could easily step up and take the responsibilities of a deaconess (in my opinion).

 

It depends where you are. South Africa has Anglican convents with both nuns and monks.

 

Here's the link for Anglican religious communities in Canada: http://www.anglican.ca/faith/ministry/communities/

 

Are you in the same parish? I know the REC has parishes in Canada as does the ACNA. If you feel called keep seeking the path God has given you.

I disagree greatly with your deacon. If you have been called by God the life of the religious and ordained is not easier. Being laity is very easy compared.

I do know the two nuns/deaconesses from my parish did have to leave for training and were assigned to other locations. Both Florida girls now leave up north where it actually gets cold and snows. The young man who entered religious life in now in Arkansas.

Do not be discourage, you may have to write to Bishops outside your area. But keep searching in obedience to God. God will not be denied. He will open the path for you.

I will pray for your vocation.

Blessings

Fr. Mark

 

Sadly no. The Reformation did a terrible disservice to Anglicanism in this regards.
There was a community of Nun in Maryland. But they converted to Rome years ago.
My former Rector is now a Monk in the Midwest.

Anglicanism sorely needs religious who are constantly praying for the Church.

Blessings

Fr Mark

 

I agree with your comments on deacons, priests and bishops and your description of the role of deaconesses is fine. And I agree that a renewed focus on religious orders within Anglicanism would be beneficial. But I think it is a generalisation to assume that women who want to be deaconesses are wanting "power". Nothing to do with service in the Church should be about having "power". Do men move from Priest to Bishop because they want power? Hopefully not. So why assume a woman wanting to serve as a deaconess in Church wants Power.

 

I doubt it's commonplace, but there are Anglican nuns. I don't know how many communities are in the UK, but here is an example of one.
http://holycrosschc.org.uk

 

Sorry I confused you.

Women who want to be ordained deacon, not deaconess, want the power. I see a great difference in the deaconesses I know and the women deacons I know. One is all about service. The women who are deacons think they are entitled and not as service minded.

And some men do make Bishop a career goal. I firmly believe if someone craves a position within the Church, the Church was serve itself well to deny them.

I never sought ordination. I was extremely happy as a US Marine. I had my company......but God chose otherwise. He took that away. He sent people to tell me I sought seek ordination. I ran. I refused. Until the day I gave a sermon at a relatives funeral. It was in New Orleans. After the service, I had a Jewish lady who lived through a concentration camp and a Roman Catholic Nun come up to me. Asked me where I was ministering. After they heard my response, I was roundly "fussed" at by these two Southern belles. They told me of my duty to God, how I would never find peace...one hit my hand and the other told me I was breaking God's heart. I went home, spoke with my wife. Then my pastor. His response was about time. They paid my way to seminary. I never felt worthy, and still don't. At times I tell God "with friends like you, who needs enemies". If I could have stayed a Marine, I would have been content.
When I went to Anglicanism, I was content to sit in the pew. After a few weeks, my Rector came to my house. He told me vacation time was over and it was time to start my training to be an Anglican Priest. I actually laughed out loud. Later with my Bishop, when he told me he could see the Holiness of Christ in me, I wanted nothing to do with it. They continued. I prayed and now I serve the Church. I may bring the mentality of a Marine with me, but I serve and I think the worse thing that could happen to me or the Church would to make me a Bishop. When a man comes to me, or a woman and I see the desire for power or control......I advise my Bishop not to proceed. I have only done it twice where my Bishop disagreed. Both Deacons later turned out to be wolves in sheeps clothing and have harmed two parishes. Sadly they are not both in the ACNA Diocese.

Every time I approach the altar, I tell God I am not worthy and to make me worthy through Christ.

If any man or woman approaches me and says they are called by God and then give me their career path. They are not seeking to serve. If they get angry if they do not get what they want...they are not seeking to serve. If they go from Bishop to Bishop until they get what they want and not what God and Church decree....they are not seeking to serve. Every female Deacon I have asked if they would give up what they have for the Church has responded negatively. The Deaconesses in my Diocese, if the Bishop called them today and said they were being moved and would have to give up some aspect of their life......would not respond negatively. Would only seek to serve the Church.

That is the difference I see between the deaconess and the female deacon. One put Church over self. The other does not.

Blessings,

Fr. Mark

 

Thanks for the clarification Fr Mark and thanks for sharing your story.

 

Thank you for posting your wonderful and inspiring story, Father Mark. You are using your sharp discernment to help the church, and what a good thing that is for the church.

I found this article about deaconesses, and it's a wise refutation to those who think that deaconess = 1st step to WO. http://www.recdss.org/On_being_Deaconess.html