What Lutherans articulate in doctrine, Anglicans put in action at the altar. I have had a close relationship with Episcopal parishes all my life and am delighted by full communion. Together, we are the Catholic Protestants.
I think tho' that the Roman church would have some difficulties with some of the Episcopalian stances. There certainly are some similarities between Lutherans (ELCA) and Episcopalians tho'. BTW, welcome to the forums!
Welcome. My godfather was a priest in the Augustana Synod, which alas got swallowed up into the ELCA.
Thank you, all. It appears that there is little if anything that divides Lutherans from Anglicans especially after the issue of apostolic succession was resolved/re-implemented among Lutherans.
This may be true of the mainline and liberal representatives of each movement but it is not so for the conservative and moderate factions. It may seem counter-intuitive but the further to the right one goes in either movement, the more disagreement there is. I believe this is because at a certain point conservatives become reactionary and make every disagreement into a significant issue. Also, most AngloCatholics would chafe at being labeled Protestant.
Yes, some Lutherans also resent being called 'Protestant'. Lutherans in Sweden/ Finland/ Tanzania, etc are very catholic but also very liberal concerning female priests and same-sex marriage. Here in the U.S. most Lutherans now embrace apostolic succession except some very conservative groups.
There were 2 bishops in apostolic succession at the recent consecration of presiding bishop of the Evangelical Lutheran Diocese of North America.
It was only parially resolved. The ELCA, which is quite liberal, is the only American Lutheran Synod, at least as far as I know, to have apostolic succession since they signed the "Concordant"withe The Episocopal Church. None of the other Lutheran Churchs (LCMS,WELC,etc) signed the agreement. Even within the ELCA,there was much debate. An ELCA pastor (female so ???) I know is among the group that got ordained without the apostolic succession. Appearantly an alternate ordination service was created. That , and the fact that the ELCA signed inter-communion agreements with Reformed and Presybyterian Churchs, which have a differant sacramental theology under certain conditions have fueled my departure from the ELCA. It would appear to me that the ELCA and the TEC are a good fit, if church's were to get "married". The larger , more conservative Lutherans such as the LCMS have at least attempted to stay online with Orthodox Lutheran Theology, and I get the impression are friendly with the ACNA. If the LCMS wanted apostolic succession, they could probably work something out with the ACNA. The current ACNA congregation I occasionally attend rents space from a LCMS church.
Also, most AngloCatholics would chafe at being labeled Protestant.[/QUOTE] I have heard/read discusion among High Church Lutherans that they are "Evangelical Catholics"..not Protestants !!!
That is definitely another synod and a confessional (conservative) one too! I'm glad. There are talks in the hierarchy of the LCMS about changing the polity to AS and I would certainly welcome it.
I have heard/read discusion among High Church Lutherans that they are "Evangelical Catholics"..not Protestants !!![/QUOTE] Yup! One here. As an AngloCatholic at heart, at the moment I do consider myself as an Evangelic Catholic.
My understanding is that Lutherans, worldwide have essentially embraced apostolic succession as an acceptable historic form of episcopal governance. The Lutheran World Federation represents 90% of all Lutherans and most of these regional national communions have maintained historic apostolic succession in Europe and Africa or adopted episcopacy/ AS in America. The Lutheran-Catholic dialogue efforts to reunite the Church addresses the ecumenical importance of apostolic succession under the primacy of Rome. Full communion with Episcopalians in America required Lutherans to adopt AS. But many Lutherans view the validity of the sacraments/ ministry in other Christian denominations who profess the ecumenical creeds; such as Reformed/ Presbyterian/ Methodist churches. We may not entirely agree on certain doctrines such as the Real Presence but don't see that as an acceptable reason to remain separate. I have a very high opinion of Missouri Synod and suspect they will also return to the ancient practice of episcopacy and apostolic successions like many Lutherans in America and Canada. The issue of female clergy and same-sex marriage sadly continues to split from within the Anglican/ Lutheran Churches.
My first love (during high school) was Lutheran. She was MO Synod, very staunchly so. But I found out that she believed (and claimed that her church taught her) that nearly all people will go to heaven sort of by default, and that only the very overtly wicked (murders and such) and the people who consciously refuse salvation will go elsewhere. Sort of a semi-universalist view, I think. I'm wondering if that really is what LCMS teaches or if she was taught wrong. Do any of you know?
NALC also has a bishop. But like ELDoNA they only have one active bishop at any given time. That's okay for ELDoNA, they've only got a couple dozen congregations. But NALC has several hundred churches. ELDoNA has a paper on Lutheran episcopacy that argues episcopacy derives primarily from the teaching office of the keys, rather than the apostolic authority. I say it derives from both. I visit a NALC church on occasion when I return to my hometown in OH. It's the best option for 50 miles, other than the Eastern Catholic church. I don't have a problem with the Ukrainians but they seem to be uncomfortable with me. And the Lutheran service, although very low, is more familiar to my daughters.
Not entirely sure of the point you are making. There are very little [if any] differences among Lutherans on core theological issues. Predestination is not a Lutheran belief.