For Episcopalians is being "inclusive" a real doctrine for them?

i) These new churches have moved away. That is a fact and there's no need to resort to semantics. Their followers are welcome to (re) join us.[/QUOTE]

It won't be for me to decide, but I must say something,if what the Church has held for some long years,is true, you've got a wrong idea of the Church. The Holy Catholic and Apostolic Churchisn't a social institution such as a Trade Union, or a Sodality, you become a Catholic by baptism.
It is the Body of Christ. You become a Member of Christ and it sticks with you for life. Good bad or indifferent you will be judged as a Anglican , or English Catholic. That means the rule is, Revelation, Scripture and Tradition!
Think about it. It is the Revelation of Christ that is the basic in our Church, it is recorded in scripture. Read Mark and Inwardly Digest, the Pauline Epistles say quite clearly ,'Preserve the Deposit!"

 

It won't be for me to decide, but I must say something,if what the Church has held for some long years,is true, you've got a wrong idea of the Church. The Holy Catholic and Apostolic Churchisn't a social institution such as a Trade Union, or a Sodality, you become a Catholic by baptism.
It is the Body of Christ. You become a Member of Christ and it sticks with you for life. Good bad or indifferent you will be judged as a Anglican , or English Catholic. That means the rule is, Revelation, Scripture and Tradition!
Think about it. It is the Revelation of Christ that is the basic in our Church, it is recorded in scripture. Read Mark and Inwardly Digest, the Pauline Epistles say quite clearly ,'Preserve the Deposit!"[/QUOTE]
So you left a church established in the sixteenth century for one founded in 1977.

 

Seagull?

I have explained to you that I'm an Anglican and am a member of an Anglican Communion. All through our '2000' year history, people have left, as our friend has pointed out. If you are not sure about the Catholicity of your bishops you are told to, indeed encouraged, to get 'Kosher,' ones.. For your information there were schisms, that is breaking of communion between the old Celtic Church and the new Church of England about 680,it lasted some two hundred years. In 1572, when various fissures occurred between your protestant/calvinist friends and us & then the the Romans did a runner. In 1689's or there about, when the C.of E., split over the acceptance of state intruded bishops and about the same time when William of Orange and his government allowed Freedom of worship. I agreed with the latter .
Personally, I am in the Church I was born to, but it is what the Scots used to call a Catholic Remnant!

 

i) Yes, but not the mainstream;

ii) I'm sure. I can't speak for your bishop. Do you have one?

iii) I wasn't around then, so didn't have any protestant/calvinist friends.

iv) So am I.

 

Iirc, you already petitioned Canterbury to incorporate orthodox Anglican churches that have "moved away." Please don't ruin the Inclusivist image you've constructed of yourself, in favor of Exclusivism espoused by fundamentalists like Layman or myself who argue that Many must submit to One, and Splinters must leave their division and join the Truth.

 

Let's look at this image. I am an active member of a CofE church. We are actively encouraging more people to get involved and in turn to get more involved in our community. We try to be welcoming, tolerant, patient, kind and understanding. We try to avoid being arrogant or bludgeoning people into belief.

Now tell us about your parish church, please.

 

Except when conservatives challenge you, such as on these forums, in which case you mock, belittle and dismiss them.

Except when it suits your needs, as with conservative churches which you designate as breakaways, from the center which is properly Yourself, bludgeoning others into submission.

I call your inclusive image fake and hypocritical, and I think we're within our rights to consider you a hypocrite.

My parish consists of many who'd been depressed and losing their faith due to the Episcopalian heresies for many years. Once our heroic bishop was dismissed for holding too many orthodox beliefs, our parish along with most of the old diocese as a whole risked and chose to go with him. Together as a floating diocese, we have found a different way to Canterbury through the route of the Global South.

Our church is composed of a large multitude of faithful and pious people, who can finally breathe fresh air now being out of reach of tyranny of heresy. Many who left before have now returned, and the parish is packed on most Sundays. While we are extremely friendly with welcome committees, lavish coffee hours with fresh food prepared by our parishioners, countless community outreach including the very successful Easter Egg hunt just a few days ago for the neighborhood's children, the central message we listen to is that of Sin and and Repentance. When the rector pronounces the Rite of Absolution, we intone it with him, and believe it literally. At Communion people are visibly moved at truly receiving the Body and Blood of our Lord. When we intone, as a whole church, the Our Father, the Glory be, the Doxology, the Psalms, we hear God talking to us, chiding us, reproving us for our sins, comforting us in his love, encouraging us in endless hopes. So we walk away refreshed with Grace, renewed in our conviction to cease and desist of all sin in our lives, and that the Love of God awaits all of those who are his saints, in this life and the life to come.

 

Well, I'm glad you've found a route to Canterbury. But all this talk of heresy (also used by H Churchman) is a bit strange for me.

Tell me more about these "Episcopalian heresies", please. I've only twice attended Episcopalian services, once in Philadelphia and once in Wiesbaden, and on neither occasion did it feel at all heretical. What did I miss? I've also met Episcopalians at CofE services on the Continent (Diocese of Europe) and they seemed good Anglicans to me. Perhaps the CofE shares such heresies?

 

If you have to ask, I question your seriousness altogether. Advocacy of homosexuality, abortion, women ordination, gay marriage ring a bell?

 

To which I may add the denial of hell, of heaven, Critical denial of Scriptures, rejection of miracles, and the rejection of the divinity of Christ.

In parallel with this lacking espousal of truth, there is a hardly restrainable advocacy of Social Justice, as well as Marxist tenets, principles and economics.

 

In the Church of England we do not advocate homosexuality and abortion. Gay marriage is illegal in our (established) Church. We have had female priests for some years now, and are much the better for them. In our Diocese half the ordinands are now female, as are our Vicar and Curate. Does that make us heretical?

 

i) Not applicable in the case of the CofE. The only caveat I have is about the Scriptures in that English Anglicans are unlikely to be literalist. For example, we had a working party on the evolution/creationism debate, but could not find a single creationist in our congregation. But we'd call that "critical interpretation" rather than denial. Does that make us heretics?

ii) Well, as I've said before, we've never done a survey of the 125 people on our Electoral Roll, so I can't speak for their political views. But I imagine that they would be varied. As for "Social Justice", I'm not sure how you define this, but it sounds the sort of thing the CofE would like.

 

Seeing as I mentioned marxism it should've been clear that I was not itemizing a list of heresies (which marxism hasnt been formally defined as), but describing heresy in totality.

I appreciate your deluded effort to try to make the CoE look episcopalian but as you said they firmly rejected gay marriage as a valid ecclesial reality, contra the American church which glories in all things gay and lesbian. Seeing as you don't even know how to define social justice, it is clearly largely an American phenomenon, so why you're trying to make deluded connections with the US church escapes me. I am not a Creationist either, so yet another of your straw men fails to make a point; when the US church denies scripture it denies a propositional validity to it, including the divinity of Christ which the CoE would never do. So I think it might be best for you to end your connective attempts with the US church. The Church of England maintains orthodoxy, and you DON'T SPEAK FOR IT.

 

i) I am unaware of any such efforts, deluded or otherwise.

ii) I've looked it up on Wikipedia. It is "the ability people have to realise the potential in the society where they live". It is supported by various religions, including, in the Christian community, the Roman Catholic and Methodist Churches. Also (in 2012) the Archbishop of York and Primate of England urged the government to do more to promote social justice.

iii) I'm not.

iv) Good. (I never in fact said you were).

v) I never started.

vi) Yes, it does, I'm pleased to say. Having said that, although I am an active member*, I don't speak for it any more than you speak for the Episcopal Church.

*Sidesperson, Parochial Church Councillor, member of Deanery Synod, lesson reader, twice weekly communicant.

 

That's rather a weak response, isn't it?